“We moved up here [to St.Paul with my wife] and started to teach, we very quickly found out we were not equipped either to teach or to run our own pottery, and so we decided that we had to have further training.” RunningFoundTeachWifeTrainingDecidedMovedMy WifePottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“In searching for further training we turned to England and Bernard Leach. We thought since we had responded to his book so strongly that this would be the sort of training that we would like to have. We saved money, during the summer went to Europe, and the first stop was to go to England, visit the Leach Pottery and ask Leach if he would take us on as apprentices.” IfsFirstsBookWould BeAsksSummerTrainingEuropeEnglandSavedApprenticePottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“I thought I was going to be able to use my painting ideas as decoration on pottery, but my painting did not translate into decoration on pottery. I thought it was going to, and in fact I made, while still in school, a plate with one of my paintings on it, and that's exactly what it was, it was a plate with a painting on it. It was not a decorated plate; it was just a painting superimposed over a three-dimensional ceramic form.” MadeStillsIdeasFactsUseAbleSchoolFormThreePaintingPlatesTranslateDecorationPotteryCeramics Author:Warren MacKenzie
“Alix [MacKenzie], on the other hand, found that her painting would translate much more readily into decoration, and she could play with the spacing and the intensity of imagery on the form in a way which I could not. So that when we established our pottery, I was most unhappy with my decoration.” WayPlayHandsFormFoundPaintingUnhappyIntensityTranslateImageryDecorationPotterySpacing Author:Warren MacKenzie
“[In the Field Museum of Natural History] we could see very simple, primitive, hand-built pottery from Babylonia and ancient Egypt and so forth, Greece. We could see the most sophisticated things that came out of the Orient - Japan, Korea, and China - some few pieces of European porcelain, majolica [tin glazed earthenware], and that sort of thing. But they had a marvelous collection.” HandsNaturalSimplePiecesFieldsBuiltAncientChinaCollectionsJapanMuseumsPrimitiveSophisticatedMarvelousEgyptGreeceKoreaTinAncient EgyptPotteryNatural HistoryPorcelainMuseum Of Natural History Author:Warren MacKenzie
“We thought [with Alix MacKenzie], if those are the kinds of pots from every culture that interest us, why would we think that it should be any different in mid-North America 20th century? And we decided then that our work would center around that sort of utilitarian pottery, and that's what I've done ever since.” IfsThinkingShouldKindDifferentDoneAmericaCultureInterestCenturyDecidedPot20th CenturyNorth AmericaPotteryUtilitarian Author:Warren MacKenzie
“Every day we'd trudge up the hill - it was a three-quarter-mile walk up this steep hill to the Leach Pottery, and we would take our lunch with us and generally, I guess, make a nuisance of ourselves.” ThreeWalksMilesHillsLunchQuartersSteepNuisancePottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“We asked a lot of questions and we watched everyone who was working in the studio. And we had an opportunity to sit in on discussions, aesthetic discussions at the pottery, which took place generally over tea breaks in the morning and afternoon. So we learned a lot just from being around there [with Bernard Leach ].” OpportunityBreakMorningStudiosTeaDiscussionAfternoonAestheticPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“The interesting thing was we never talked about pottery. Bernard [Leach] talked about social issues; he talked about the world political situation, he talked about the economy, he talked about all kinds of things.” WorldKindPoliticalSocialInterestingSituationEconomyIssuesAll KindsSocial IssuesInteresting ThingsPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“We [me and my wife] went back to St. Paul, worked for a year - again, I guess I would have to admit now, doing a rather shaky job of teaching people - but at the end of that year we returned to England and worked in the [Bernard] Leach Pottery for two and a half years.” PeopleYearsTwoEndsJobsHalfWifeTeachingEnglandMy WifePotteryHalf A Year Author:Warren MacKenzie
“When we worked at the pottery, we did learn to make pots, that is, the physical act of making the pot. We learned to control clay, to put it where you want it and not just wherever it wanted to go, and that was valuable. At the end of about six months, though, I think if that was all we had, we may have been inclined to leave because the workshop did not challenge us so much as living with [Bernard] Leach did.” IfsThinkingWantMayHas BeensEndsWantedChallengesMonthsSixValuablePotSix MonthsClayWorkshopsPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“Living with [Bernard] Leach, who thought about pottery 24 hours a day, was a fantastic experience, and we really began to get inside his mind and understand what had motivated him to work all his life as a potter.” MindHoursFantasticMotivatedPottersPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“We did respect [Bernard Leach], although we also were willing to challenge ideas and at least put forth our feelings about the way the pottery was run, about things that were done, about the pots we were making, etc. And we would get into sometimes some very fierce arguments. We'd be shouting at one another because of disagreements.” WayIdeasSometimesDoneFeelingsRunningChallengesWillingArgumentEtcPotFierceDisagreementShoutingPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“We were working from very exact models and dimensions and weights of clay to make these pots which had been designed some 10 or 12 years previous to our arriving [at Bernard's Leach studio]. And we, being, I guess you would say young, arrogant Americans, thought that we ought to be able to somehow express ourselves a little bit more in the daily work of the pottery.” YearsLittlesAbleYoungBitsOughtLittle BitModelsWeightStudiosDimensionsPotArrogantClayArrivingPotteryDaily Work Author:Warren MacKenzie
“Looking back on it now, I understand why that was not possible [to express ourselves], because the pottery employed a dozen people, not all of whom are making pots. And these people had families, children, and they had to have a wage that would allow them to raise their family and they had to get a paycheck every Friday afternoon. So if we had not made pots that would sell it, would not have been possible for these people to be employed.” PeopleIfsChildrenHas BeensMadeRaisesSellsPotAfternoonDozenLooking BackEmployedFridayPaychecksPotteryFriday Afternoon Author:Warren MacKenzie
“I do remember that when we left [Bernard Leach] after two and a half years, we went home on a boat again - this was before air travel became really easy - and Alix [MacKenzie] turned to me and she said, "You know, that was a great two years of training, but that's not the way we're going to run our pottery."” KnowsWayYearsSaidTwoHomeRunningRememberLeftEasyHalfAirTrainingBoatTwo YearsPotteryHalf A YearAir Travel Author:Warren MacKenzie
“It was there that we really first came in contact with the work of Shoji Hamada, who was Bernard's best friend from Japan, who had come from Japan back to England with [Bernard] Leach when Leach was establishing his pottery.” FirstsEnglandContactJapanPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“Bernard [Leach] had acquired many [Shoji] Hamada works. Some of them, it was interesting - first of all, Hamada worked in St. Ives for about four years before returning to Japan to start his own pottery. He had exhibitions in London, and if these exhibitions didn't sell out, the galleries were instructed to send the remaining work down to the Leach Pottery, where they would go into the showroom for sale. If Bernard saw one that hadn't sold that he really admired, then he would take it (he would buy it), and it would go into the house.” IfsYearsFirstsHouseInterestingSawsFourSellsLondonJapanFour YearsGalleryExhibitionsPotteryShowroom Author:Warren MacKenzie
“If [Bernard Leach] didn't like the drawing, he'd X it out and do another one and change the form a little bit. And when he was all done, he would stuff these pieces of paper in his pocket and go off to the pottery, and when he wanted to make pots, he would then take these out and he'd begin to produce the pot that he had designed on paper in front of us.” IfsLittlesDoneWantedFormStuffBitsPiecesFrontsProducePaperLittle BitDrawingPocketsPotPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“I think back to some of the pots we made when we first started our pottery, and they were pretty awful pots. We thought at the time they were good; they were the best we could make, but our thinking was so elemental that the pots had that quality also, and so they don't have a richness about them which I look for in my work today. Whether I achieve it all the time, that's another question, because I don't think a person can produce at top level 100 percent of the time.” ThinkingFirstsLooksPersonsMadeTodayLevelsQualityAchieveProducePercentAwfulPotRichnessElementalsPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“Friends of Bernard's [Leach] came to visit, and when we went to London, we were given introductions to people like Lucie Rie, Hans Coper, Richard Batram. All these people were, let's say, made available to us by a friendship with Leach. In addition there was a potter's group - what was it called? I think it was called the Cornish Potters Society, but I'm not sure of that. Anyway, they had meetings and we would go with Leach to these meetings and meet other potters, and they would have programs where they would discuss pottery and people would interchange ideas.” PeopleThinkingMadeIdeasGivenGroupsProgramMeetingsAvailableLondonNot SureIntroductionPottersPotteryInterchange Author:Warren MacKenzie
“We got a great benefit from our contact with those people [Lucie Rie, Hans Coper, Richard Batram] and met people that we wouldn't have probably met if we had simply worked at the pottery.” PeopleIfsMetsBenefitsContactPottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“And as far as I know about Alix's [MacKenzie] work, I don't believe she ever did any sculptural work at all. It was always pottery.” KnowsBelieveDon't BelievePottery Author:Warren MacKenzie
“In the Leach Pottery we did most of our work on the wheel. [Bernard] Leach did a little work in the studio, which was press-molded forms, plastic clay pressed into plaster forms to make small rectangular boxes and some vase forms, which he liked to make. These were molds which had been made to an original that he had modeled in solid clay, and during our work there, sometimes I would be pressing these forms as a means of production.” MeanLittlesMadeSometimesWould BeFormOriginalsPressesProductionsBoxesStudiosWheelsPlasticClayMoldPotteryVasesPlasters Author:Warren MacKenzie